THE WALKING DEAD: Gale Anne Hurd and Greg Nicotero Preview What’s to Come

THE WALKING DEAD has never been a particularly bright and shiny show, but things took an especially dark turn when the season-long search for Sophia culminated in the group discovering she had been turned into a walker, and Rick stepping up to exterminate her.

So what comes next?

I sat down with THE WALKING DEAD producers Gale Anne Hurd and Greg Nicotero to talk about the fallout from Sophia’s death, Rick versus Shane, and more…

The season building up to that point. Was there any doubt you’d end up there?
Gale Anne Hurd: No, it was decided pretty early on. Once we knew there was going to be a hiatus, you want to tie up some storylines. I think it was a great [way] to go out with a bang. We called the episode “Barnmaggedon.”
Greg Nicotero: One of the fun things was last season when they started prepping and they opened the writers’ room and Frank and all the writes made a field trip and came to the shop. And I said, we have all these full corpses and zombies and stuff and they came out and pitched the first eight episodes. And it was like an hour of, “Okay, and then this happens!” I was riveted. I was like the old Bugs Bunny cartoon: “Yeah, and then what happens? Yeah?” And he was like, “And then they find Sophia in the barn.” And I was like… [Gasps]
GAH: No, honestly, it was like, “And she’s okay, right?”
GN: I was astounded. But it fits within our world. If she was okay, it wouldn’t have been THE WALKING DEAD. As much as you really want the happy endings, the world is over. There’s a little patch of people that have survived, and you have to step back and look globally at the fact that so many people have lost someone in the past history of the show, that what I like about how the way the season plays out is, Daryl finds the doll, and then you’re sort of holding out a little bit of hope going, maybe, maybe. And then Shane steps up and is like, “Why are you putting us all in jeopardy when we all know she’s gone?” And it’s like, how can you say that, from an aspect of sheer humanity? How can you ever give up? You can’t in good conscious. And that’s the whole issue between Rick and Shane.

It was fascinating to watch that search for Sophia as a viewer, because we’re used to kids being “safe” on TV. Sometimes they get sick or hurt, but rarely are they killed off.
GAH: Not on our show!
GN: Pretty much anyone is fair game. A minute into the first episode…
GAH: We’ve had a lot of discussions about that, but the truth is, child are the most vulnerable. They’re going to be the hardest to keep alive. This is not a world where you can make mistakes. It’s a world where, literally, your mortality is on the line 24/7.
GN: And being on Hershel’s farm, it certainly has swept our group into a sense of safety. We have fences, we have food, we have electricity, we’ll be fine. And then to find out not only is there a barn full of walkers, but the person they had been vying to save for the entire first seven episodes, not only did not survive, but ended up in that barn.
GAH: And with that, what is that now going to do to Hershel? He has been on that tightrope, should I let them stay or should I not let them stay? And now, Shane has taken — he has completely violated the deal that was made, usurped Rick’s leadership, this has to happen. He’s taken choice away. And Hershel has to confront, can he continue to tell himself that this is an illness and as a doctor, he will someday be able to cure his family?

How will this impact the group dynamic going forward? I’d imagine Rick would feel guilt about his role in Sophia’s death, but for everyone else…
GAH: And that’s the interesting thing — I don’t think Shane feels guilt.
GN: Shane…he literally steps up and says, this needs to be done. We need to save Carl and we need medicine. If something gets in the way of me, then I will eliminate that. He kills Otis without even blinking an eye. And you get that sense that…there’s this great shot when he’s in the bathroom shaving his head and there’s a malevolence of [Jon] Bernthal’s performance [as Shane]; he has a great tell when he rubs the top of his head. And then you see him with Sarah Callies (Lori) —
GAH: Or Carl!
GN: There’s a great moment in that last episode where she says, we’re never going to be together and he’s heartbroken. What I love about Jon Bernthal is you see the anger and the sadness and the fear and the rage all over.
GAH: He would do anything for them! Every decision he makes is not just for himself, it’s to protect Lori and Carl. And then you look at Rick and his decisions are, yes, I need to protect them, but first I need to protect the group. First I need to protect other people.

He does put himself in danger so many times.
GN: And he walks away from his family. And when Shane says, “You don’t have it in you to protect your wife and your son. I do. I saved them, I protect them.” Telling a man that he’s not a man for his family, I can’t imagine a more powerful, antagonistic thing to say.
GAH: And he’s someone who’s still a throwback to when things were different. When as law enforcement, you put your family second, because that’s what you do. That’s the oath you’ve given. He’s living in that world. And Shane is not. Shane has said, “Everything has changed, you can’t do that. The people who will survive, the families that will survive, will survive because you’re willing to change under these new circumstances.” And Rick hasn’t gotten there yet.

It’s no secret that Shane didn’t survive this long in the comic book series, and now, it almost feels like he’s become a dead man walking on the television show. He’s done some truly terrible things, he’s antagonized virtually everyone…
GAH: But he’s right! That’s the thing — you see the reaction, you see building up to this. Dale is very clear. He’s even more so than Rick, with, “No, this is the wrong thing and you are dangerous.” But when he was given the opportunity to kill him, he didn’t. He couldn’t do that. So it creates this scenario where the love triangle, as well as the leadership conflict between Rick and Shane, is so important to the show.

With all this talk about what has gone on, what can you tease about the midseason premiere?
GAH: One of the things that the comic book really makes clear, and is something that is a key component, is often what you have to fear even more than the zombies are your fellow humans. We start to mix it up with people who aren’t from around here. Some people who can you trust them or can you not? And we’ll find out the answer in the first episode back.
GN: The midseason relaunch starts from the exact moment that episode 8 ended. So we start on Rick, he’s holding the gun, he’s hovering on dead Sophia, and we see how fractured the group is. And what i love about Shane’s character is sometimes he is a bull in a china shop, but he does the right thing. He just doesn’t handle it the way same of the rest of us would. But he certainly has Andrea and T-Dog, who you always get the sense are in Camp Shane. And you have Glenn and Dale who are the moral strength of the group. And you have Hershel and Rick. What Sophia’s death does it fractures the group and makes those lines a lot more apparent. And if you could keep the group whole against the walkers and outside influences and groups we may run into. But it becomes tremendously exciting.

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THE WALKING DEAD returns tonight at 9 PM on AMC.

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